The smaller the number, the larger the wire. I have a basement that offers an 18" concrete ledge that goes around the entire perimeter of the house that lends itself perfectly to a neat layout. In either case, however, voltage and amperage draw is low and peak for only brief periods. Lionel Multi-Car Freight Sets + More MTH Halloween! The next evolution in model train control is radio- or bluetooth-controlled trains. Anyway if it takes me 100 years to finish this thing one thing is for sure I will not have to worry about powering anything and everything. Service/Tested $55.00 1 bid $14.06 shipping 1d 6h LIONEL TYPE (KW) TRAINMASTER TRANSFORMER FOR PARTS OR RESTORATION $17.05 4 bids $19.95 shipping 9h 23m It does run on conventional power but not great and no whistle or bell. Willoughby, Ohio - the home of the CP & E RR. The first is the traditional or classic size, which are the cars that match starter sets. $2799. Although all Lionel cars operate on O Gauge track, the bodies of the cars are made in two slightly different sizes. But a 12-gauge solid wire is one strand, while a 12-gauge stranded wire may be made up of more than a dozen much smaller individual strands spun together. You should always, always test your transformer for safetybefore you set it up, andunplug it when youre not using it. By continuing to use this site, you indicate you accept these terms. If you want a spur track to store an extra car or two, Lionel makes another expansion set [#12044] that does just that: Note that this set includes one switch which is the track section that makes the track diverge onto two separate routes. American Flyer Trains were made in several gauges. That could also be the reason the other transformers don't work. If your track joints aren't near perfect or if you should want to split that loop into two blocks, you'll double the voltage drop. Solid wire is preferable as it is much easier to solder to the rails. Lionel makes a seemingly infinite number of cars to in a variety of colors, types, and road names. Tech Support for the OGR Forum (NOT FOR TRAINS), PRR fellas!lets build an S2!! Controlled Magnetics has the manufacturing experience, knowledge, and facilities to repair a wide variety of electrical power transformers. I run an MTH 4-6-2 PS-1 pulling five Madisons on about fifty feet of track and the transformer I am using (Z-4000) has a digital amp readout. If you make a complete loop of 100 feet with good track joints, you'll have something like .1 ohm from the transformer to the farthest point, using the rule of thumb that most track is something like 16 AWG wire (.004 ohms per foot) and that there are two 50 foot tracks feeding the farthest point from two directions. If the transformer fails, you most likely have a short or overload somewhere in the control circuit. Note: if you proceed, you will no longer be following, $12.00 per 12 Months (plus tax if applicable). This drawing illustrates all of the key functionality of a Lionel KW transformer. The Lionel RW also happens to be a great transformer for Marx or American Flyer trains too, when you connect the track leads to the B and U posts instead of the A and U posts youd normally use for most Lionel setups. Smaller layouts (a typical 4 foot by 8 foot being a good example) can usually get by with Number16 since the length of the run from the power supply to the track is never more than a few feet. Outdoor railroads are, of course, an exception! I have had the same problem. Also, I found an old guide printed by lionel on power requirements. editors report that most of the wiring issues they address involve basic principles of electricity - the stuff that Ben Franklin played with when he flew his kite. They are reasonably durable and were popular in their day, which means there are still a lot of them floating around so they tend to be inexpensive. As time goes on you can add higher wattage bricks one by one. If you found this post informative or helpful, please share it! If you have the proper wire size and a properly-sized circuit breaker, you should not have any problems using the old transformer. This is where the Lionel transformer comparisons should begin. www.spankybird.shutterfly.com, God bless TCA 05-58541 Benefactor Member of theNRA, Member of the American Legion, Retired Boss Hog of Roseyville , KC&D Qualified. IF the Engineer is the guy that drives the locomotive then theTechnician must be the fireman is this correct? Likewise, if you only want to run one train at a time, you can keep other trains on the track by wiring with blocks, and turning off trains that are not in use. Electric Trains make great power supplies, depending on usage, on a DCS controlled layout. Sell Your Trains To A Train Dealer or a Single Buyer. If youre buying a transformer, youll be able to easily find one that a professional refurbished and upgraded with the links I provide below. Understanding Electrical Supplies and Controls. Of course, if you happen to have enough Number12 wire left over from a home renovation project to install all the buses on your small layout, it won't do any harm. In most cases, stranded wire is preferred because the multiple threads provide more conductivity and flexibility. Get DIY project ideas and easy-to-follow crafts to help you spruce up your space. An Essential Guide for Toy Train Enthusiasts! * NOTE: We do not recommend loading a transformer above 80% of its KVA rating. In some cases. And even when Lionel trains run on AC, they sometimes do some DC trickery. Dave: That certainly qualifies, don't forget the anti-gun lobbyist with the picket sign's. I can remember a time when a Lionel ZW would set you back $275. They do not include a track or power supply, so you will need to buy both separately. A large number of the Lionel Collectors Club UK use this set up to good effect. All members here are welcome to drop in and visit. Its a good transformer. And again regardless of scale or manufacturer, switch machines of these two types will have similar needs and performance. From 25 Watts to 275 Watts, a Lionel transformer could be found for every power requirment from simple circles of track to extensive railroads. Serious or fatal injuries may result. Doug Murphy 'We few, we happy few, we band of brothers' Henry V. I am a person with a very active inner child. Our community is FREE to join. The other type of cars are the Scale cars, which are exact or near-exact replicas of actual freight cars. Classification/marker lights on the PRR steam engine, For Sale: Lionel 6-11127 Legacy Southern Pacific GS-4 Daylight, Lionel Bethlehem Steel slag car and ATLAS NYC Baggage car, Lionel O 2333790 TrainWorld & RBP Trains Chris Raines -Exclusive - Katy LEGACY ES44AC #2021, Converting MTH Rail king GS-4 PROTO 2 to ERR Cruise Commander, The Harpers Ferry Layout II - Backdrop panels completed. A starter set is the best way to start with the train hobby. The iconic and legendary 270-wattLionel ZW was the biggest and best transformer Lionel made in the postwar era. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. If they do, follow their recommendations. Lionels HO Gauge items are back! Transformer sizing for new systems God bless TCA 05-58541 Benefactor Member of theNRA, Member of the American Legion, Retired Boss Hog of Roseyville , KC&D Qualified. I will make a note here. Again, if you have a very long run between switches, going a little larger is less likely to cause problems with voltage loss. How to open tamper resistant outlets, Xxcopy vs Xcopy: Command line copy utilities, Where to connect the red wire to a light switch, Brains 25 cents: The story behind the meme. Classic cars have a 5 or 6 as their second digit [25051, 16686, etc]. Ryan developsmodeltrainlayouts for public andprivate display. Today, with some luck, you can get one for closer to $100. You can't count on a lack of compatibility issues for one Legacy locomotive being definitive for all Legacy locomotives, for example. Improve ready-to-run freight cars with a little paint. The CW-80 is a nice little transformer, has accessory output as well,but as you have stated you will outgrow the CW-80 pretty quick. Number 24 to Number20 wire will all work with most layouts. I cant see you needing more than a capacity of 5 amps. Never had a problem. This conserves the trains' power supply for their needs and makes troubleshooting much easier. This tool will allow you calculate the KVA that you need. Make sure you are getting the right type of power supply for your layout. The 190-wattLionel KWwas the second biggest and second best transformer of the postwar era. A lot of people are using the MTH Z1000's who have smaller layouts while others have moved up to the MTH Z4000. This is because the demands for power are becoming more than your transformer can handle. In the middle range, Lionel made a lot of other transformers. To participate you must either login or register for an account. [:)]. With multiple switches, lights, power supplies and more all concentrated in a small space, color coding and neatness pay off. I justhave a very basic 027 set (guessin' mid 80's?). The 110-wattLionel RW is a cheap option, and the 125-watt LW, while a bit more expensive, gives a bit more power. This is interesting stuff. Lionel is also introducing a new 180 watt transformer to accompany the 80 watt CW 80. That said, if youre uncomfortable fixing a transformer, I wont look down on you for buying one someone else fixed up. The wire can also be purchased as solid or stranded. I bet they would be great for running lights and unloading the main transformer. If the second digit is 9, it could be either, so be careful when considering one of them. Both are lighted. properly wired transformer can handle any amount of track. Its expensive, but the same factors that drove KW prices down are also driving ZW prices down. I use to use one KW for 70 feet of main line, sidings and switching yard entry track. A small set that came with track, transformer, etc. Lionel Ready-to-Play is a large sized train that's made to be affordable and easy-to-use for both kids and adults alike. UpBright 18V AC/DC Adapter Compatible with Lionel O Gauge Fastrack 10" Remote Control Terminal Straight LionChief System Track 6-1923100 HKYF45-180230T-US DC18V 2300mA 18VDC Power Supply Cord Charger. On a large loop of track you will need to have multiple drops, hook-ups, to the transformer because if you only have one hook up the train will get slower the father away it gets from the transformer. With the ever-increasing amount of small electronics in today's sophisticated models, this protection is more important than ever. These systems still require a power supply but it only needs to supply a constant voltage to the rails. To amplify CTvalley's very valid instructions: A forum community dedicated to model train owners and enthusiasts. But if you already have a 1034 and dont need a whistle button, go ahead and use it. Lionel 1033 90 watt Transformer Postwar from 1950s-60s Whistle, Direction. Because the runs are short and power demands so low, this fine wire poses no safety threat. Some systems will use bluetooth technology enabling you to control the trains with your tablet or cell phone. The backside of a control panel can turn into a "rat's nest" of wiring very quickly. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. (Electrical Contractor with dear old Dad for 30 years) Regards Steve. Starter set locomotives can pull up to 12 cars easily, and most can handle up to 20, so building a longer train will not harm your engine. They have everything you need for a basic setup, and the larger ones are capable of running the smaller layouts you see in the train magazines, so they have some room for growth. The two types of cars will connect together just fine, but when side-by-side in a train, they may look a bit odd. Lionel makes two expansion sets for this purpose. Adding more freight or passenger cars [also known as rolling stock] to your set is another way to quickly expand your railroad. The Lionel 1033 is a great choice for small or medium-sized layouts. Here are a few: --The Lionel Fastrack Book, by Robert Schleicher. Theres nothing inherently wrong with them, though I would shy away from the smaller transformers that are less than 75 watts, including the modern CW-40. If you're experiencing problems with your wiring due to humidity, for example, you are going to face even greater issues with the trains and tracks themselves. As you progress with your layout there are a lot of people here who will help you with any questions you have. As the kit grows and you start putting in turnouts (or the point switching systems) to move your train from one track to another track, you will not only need more than 1 transformer, you will. My question is.how big of a transformer will I need to power this thing? Now, I diconnected that old dinosaur and connected two separate smaller ones which weren't powerful enough to run my Amtrack MTH trains. --I need a station for the train to stop at. Plan on using the KW's for the big layout and 1033's like I did before. As your layout grows so, too, will its power demand. You must be signed in to continue. Doug, there's definitely room for the liberal arts approach to the hobby--I have a journalism degree; how I became a computer technician was pretty much an accident. Effort. It can run four tracks at one time, so you layout can grow. The insulation on the outside of the wire also varies greatly. For many first-time train buyers, once the initial excitement of setting up the train and watching it run has passed, the desire to make it do more usually begins. On the flip side, the new transformers do not seem to work as well with the prewar whistle tenders.Has anyone else noticed this anomaly? Ryan Kunkle is a nationally recognized professional model train expert and writer with over 25 years of experience. For a 300W set up this will cost you about 100. Alternating current (AC) is the preferred power for most O Gauge three-rail trains as well as some two-rail systems in smaller scales. The KW has constant voltage outputs for accessories, the ZW don't have that feature just four handles for supplying power to four tracks or accessories if you like, both have whistle & direction feature. Fortunately, in the early 21st century it is easier to expand your starter set than ever before. Some of the variables are obvious, others not so much. They're controlled with a simple handheld remote control and run on easy-to-connect plastic track. Again, an independent power supply and distribution bus is a good idea for your switches. Everything you need to get going is included, its reliable, and setup is usually very easy. I have noticed that my old transformers do not work well or not work at all with newer electronic whistle tenders. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. The best of the best Lionel trains are very valuable. When you get DCS, keep the blocks and run the 2 sets off 2 Fixed channels out. THE BASICS "O", "S", "HO". Price Received. Join Today! Just get a Lionel #12053 Accessory wire set and enough extra wire to connect from the wire set back to your transformer [speaker wire works well]. From 25 Watts to 275 Watts, a Lionel transformer could be found for every power requirment from simple circles of track to extensive railroads. I paid $75 + shipping for mine a year ago. A locomotive on a mile-long loop will draw as many amps as it does on a 4x8 platform. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. (NEW/LIKE NEW), running TMCC And DCS engines with DCS handheld, terrible crash in Greece, multiple fatalities, Its.Public Delivery Track ..NEWSpecial run corner, Improving Appearance of 0-gauge Tubular Track. Price Received. Get the Classic Toy Trains newsletter delivered to your inbox twice a month, Calculating transformer size for layout size. Just not quite as much. However, if you begin to add lighted cars, or more than a couple accessories, you may find that your train will not run as fast, or that it will shut off entirely. The car on the left is scale, and the one on the right is the classic, underscale size. Heavier insulation not only adds to the cost of the wire but also makes it harder to bend. If you need a device that converts from different voltages so it can power another device, then a transformer will fulfill that role perfectly. OTTS Founder Reverse the above if planning to run mostly Lionel and go with the Lionel command system, either the full Legacy system or the upcoming CAB-1L and just add a Track Power Controller and a cable to run most MTH engines in conventional with the Lionel systems. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. Adding lights to buildings, streets, and other scenic accessories usually do not require anywhere near the amperage demand of the trains themselves. I've got around 320 ft of track between all of the mainline, sidings, etc and I don't have any problems running my engines anywhere on the layout. That transformer will only prolly handle 1 engine and depending on how long it is will depend on how many extra feeders you will need around the layout. Traditionally, Lionel trains run on AC but there are exceptions. As your needs grow, you can employ a larger transformer of fixed voltage. Forgot about light bulbs since I don't got some yet. If you add a lot of track and find that your train slows down as it gets farther from your transformer, you will need to run jumper wires to the opposite side of your track layout. The farther from the transformer the more resistance in the rails and your engine will slow down. If you have a starter set and have had thoughts like this, youre not alone. The smaller of the two is #12028, which turns your oval into this: There is also the larger 12031 plan, which has a couple extra straight track pieces included, creating this: Even better, one or more of the expansion sets can be combined to create even more interesting track layouts. The motor takes electricity through a small wire attached to a metal wheel that rests on the middle rail underneath. Extending the Reach of Your Power If you have time, check out the "Coffee Pot". Sell Your Trains Through an Online Auction Service. Take the hint. What about removing flanges from diesel wheels? The typ miniature incandecents we use average about 100 ma of current each. Although it will not have any impact on the performance of the wire within, choosing multiple colors of wire, and standardizing on a specific color for each function, will go a long way in making your wiring easier to install and easier to detect flaws later on. Transformer capacity is rated in KVA (kilo-volt-amperes). Lionel Trains Pocket Price Guide 1901-2022. The new Lionel ZW-L is getting a lot of good reviews and is a very powerful transformer for most layouts. --The O Gauge Railroading Primer, by Christopher Ritchie. I'm guessing the MTH Z1000 is around $100 and the other suggestions are much more expensive. For Lionel power the 45 watts is good for a 4 by 8 as a rule of thumb to compensate poor track you just use more feeders. With two switches, you can create an alternative route for your trains. Why Sign In? For a passenger train with lighted cars, getting a little more power isnt a bad idea. This has the added advantage that Lionel TMCC (command control) will operate correctly. For a transformer less or equal to 500 kilovolt-amperes, a typical %Z impedance may vary between 2.3% and 5.2% based on the voltage level. These sets use a remote control which talks directly to a receiver in the locomotive. This signifies compatibility with 50 Hertz power. Over the years I have collected boxed(mostly liquor boxes) sets from attics.So I have a variety of transformers on hand. View More! My layout I am building is 5 sheets of 4x8 plywood and it will probaly take me 100 years to build it (I hope I have that much time left). Steve's rule of thumb for derating is very close to and in the same spirit as the NEC rule that an appliance may not draw more than 80 percent of the current rating of the outlet.